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evolraver

Inside the line
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Posts: 8
Reply with quote  #1 
So I've been trying to find lyrics of the JD rehearsal recording of Ceremony from the Heart and Soul box set, but can't find them.

I used the search function on this site and read several posts stating that this topic has already been discussed, but could not find the original thread. Perhaps I became interested too late.

Please post your interpretation of the lyrics to the rehearsal version of Ceremony. Let's compare...

Thanks,
Richie

The Only Mistake
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Posts: 598
Reply with quote  #2 

Here's an initial attempt.. some lines are

just impossible to make out. It's possible

he hadn't actually finished writing the

lyrics at this stage.

 

 

this is why events unnerve me

would you say the same old story

this is why the wheels are turning

turn away and turn against this time

....calling

....we will be here

...someone

....again and turn towards this time

 

i'll break them all, no mercy shown

heaven knows it's got to come sometime

....?

...cried and failed to wake this time

 

i'll break them all, no mercy shown

heaven knows it's got to be somewhere?

avenues all lined with trees

picture me and then you start watching

 

watching forever

watching forever

everything letting me know

for everything letting it go

...?

evolraver

Inside the line
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Reply with quote  #3 
Thanks. Your post made me re-listen to the song and make tiny modifications to my set of lyrics.

The closing words are so muffled and undecipherable on the rehearsal version that it's really hard for me to guess what Ian is actually saying...

We have too much time on our hands.

---------------------------------------------------------

This is why it's so unnerving.
Then again the same old story.
This is why the wheels are turning.
Turn away and turn again this time.
This is not the same old story.
Not again, but we will be here.
Travel fast and now I'm stopping.
Turn again and turn towards this time.

I'll break them all, no mercy shown.
Heaven knows, it's got to get closer.
What she heard, the things they said.
The times she cried.
Too frail to wake this time.

I'll break them all, no mercy shown.
Heaven knows, it's got to be closer.
Avenues all lined with trees.
Picture me and then you start watching.
Watching forever, watching forever.

Every time, letting this go.
Forever, just letting this go.
Every time, letting me go.

(Joy Division live version)

I'll break them all, no mercy shown.
Heaven knows, it's got to be closer.
What she heard, the things she said.
The times she cried.
Too frail to wake this time.

I'll break them all, no mercy shown.
Heaven knows, it's got to be this time.
Avenues all lined with trees.
Picture me, instead you start watching.
Watching forever, watching forever.

Forever, watching love grow.
Forever, watching love grow.
Forever, letting me know.

----------------------------------------------------
scopes

Inside the line
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Posts: 12
Reply with quote  #4 

Ok, been screwing around with some of the EQ settings on my Ipod which has cleared things up a bit but, like the other two said, some of the lines are still pretty muffled.

Here's what I got:

 

-----------------------------------------------------

 

This is why events unnerve me
Could it be the same old story?
This is why the wheels are turning.
Turn away and turn against this time.
Listen to the seas they're calling 
Find a way and we will be there 
Traveled fast but now want higher

Think again and change it's way this time.

Oh I'll break them all, no mercy shown.
Heaven knows, it's got to get somewhere
Watching her, these things they said
The times she cried.
Too frail to wake this time.

I'll break them all, no mercy shown.
Heaven knows, it's got to be somewhere
Avenues all lined with trees.
Picture me and then you start watching.
Watching forever

Watching forever.

Everything, let it be so.
For everything, let it be so.
Forever, always be so.

evolraver

Inside the line
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Posts: 8
Reply with quote  #5 
Brilliant!

That last few lines are the most frustrating to listen to...

They're too muffled. Anyone else?
ravachol

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Day of The Lords
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Posts: 290
Reply with quote  #6 
This is what I once found in the internet:

"pressure's high and failed(?) unnerving
when they tell the same old story
but it's why the wheels are turning
turn away and turn again this time
thought i heard the saviour calling
time again and we will be there
notice that the tide walks higher
think again and change its flow this time

i'll break them all, no mercy shown
heaven knows i've got to get somewhere
watching her, a sinking ship - that
empty and quiet sailed away this time.

i'll break them all, no mercy shown
heaven knows i've got to be somewhere
avenues all lined with trees
picture me in tenuous times

watching forever...
forever...
watching forever..."

Not sure, if it's 100% right, but some passages sound more convincing to me - I'm not a native english speaker - than the lines above. Maybe a mixture of those will bring us further to Ian's words.

Dirk

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We used to always meet here"
Keef

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Atmosphere
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Reply with quote  #7 

Ok, so I was bored and had a spare 10 minutes and for what it's worth I think this part...

 

i'll break them all, no mercy shown
heaven knows i've got to get somewhere

 

is actually....

 

I've hurt them all, no mercy shown

heaven knows it's got to get better

Brett

Candidate
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Posts: 309
Reply with quote  #8 
I seem to remember the original discussion which got lost included the line "Listen to the saints, they're calling". This seems a particularly Curtis-esque line, and fits with the Heart and Soul rehearsal recording pretty accurately.
evolraver

Inside the line
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Reply with quote  #9 
I wonder if we'll ever know Ian's original Ceremony lyrics.
Richie

The Only Mistake
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Reply with quote  #10 
Stephen Morris definately sings the line 'Listen to the saints, they're calling' on the Western Works demo version from July 1980.. maybe that's where that interpretation came from. Ian must have written them down at some point but I guess New Order never had access to that, if the stories about them having to run the JD rehearsal tape through an equalizer to transcribe what he was singing are true.
TJ

Ceremony
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Reply with quote  #11 

Sounded like "this is why the dead unnerve me" this morning on the train into work!

rililley

Inside the line
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Reply with quote  #12 

I was listening to 'Still' recently and was surprised to find that the last verse doesn't seem to be the same as the New Order version. It sounds like Ian sings 'picture me in ten years time watching'. Anyone else agree?

TJ

Ceremony
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Posts: 1,162
Reply with quote  #13 
No doubt at all to me that he sings "picture me in ten years time watching".

If we do Ceremony at our gig on Saturday, I shall be singing the following:

This is why the dead unnerve me
when they tell the same old story
this is why the wheels are turning
turn away and turn again this time
listen to the saints, they’re calling
time again and we will be there
travelled fast but now I’m stopping
think again and turn towards this time

I’ve hurt them all, no mercy shown
heaven knows it’s got to get better
watching her, a sinking ship

The times she cried too frail to wake this time.

I’ve hurt them all, no mercy shown
heaven knows i've got to get somewhere
avenues all lined with trees
picture me in ten years time watching

forever...
forever...
watching forever..

 

or something like that


rililley

Inside the line
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Reply with quote  #14 

So, at least two of us agree! Some support for Torn Aparts case for Ian wishing to leave the band perhaps? Although 10 years is quite a deadline to set!

Novelty06

Gutz
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Reply with quote  #15 

Hm...Im fooling around with the Nose Removal software on my computer, and trying to decifer it...


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Heart and Soul...what?
TJ

Ceremony
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Reply with quote  #16 

Heaven Nose it's got to be this time?

Novelty06

Gutz
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Reply with quote  #17 
This is why the tables are turning
They keep telling the same old story
This is why the wheels are turning
Turn away and turn towards this time
I can hear the (muffled) are calling
(muffled)....and he will be there
..
He turns away and turns towards this time

I'll hurt them all, no mercy shown
Heavens know he's got to crack sometime
Watching her the things she'd said
I heard her cry too frail to wake this time

I'll break them all, no mercy shown
Heaven knows it's got to break sometime
The avenues are lined with trees
Picture me in ten years time watching

Watching forever
Watching forever
Forever letting me know
Forever where did he go?
Forever
Forever letting me know

Anyone?


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Heart and Soul...what?
evolraver

Inside the line
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Reply with quote  #18 
Based off the multiple interpretations above, including my own, and after listening to the rehearsal version of Ceremony again and again, I've come up with yet another interpretation.

See below.

-------------------------------------------------------

This is how it’s so unnerving, when they say the same old story.

This is why the wheels are turning. Turn away and turn again this time.

Listen now the seas, they’re calling. Time again and we will be there. Travelled fast but now I’m stopping. Think again and change its way this time.


I’ve hurt them all, no mercy shown. Heaven knows it’s got to get better. Watching her, a sinking ship. The times she cried too frail to wake this time.

I’ll break them all, no mercy shown. Heaven knows it’s got to be closer. Avenues all lined with trees. Picture me in ten years still watching.

Watching forever.
Watching forever.

Every time, letting this go.
Forever, letting this go.
Every time, letting me go.

stepoutside

No Love Lost
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Posts: 143
Reply with quote  #19 

Supposedly in the audience recording of the Birmingham concert you can hear all of the vocals in Ceremony, unlike the soundboard recording on Still where the vocals of the first half of the song are inaudible.  Also, the soundcheck for this concert includes Ceremony and it's on a bootleg called Out of the Room.  If anybody has either of these recordings maybe they can figure out the lyrics and post them here.

TJ

Ceremony
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Posts: 1,162
Reply with quote  #20 
You cannot hear all the lyrics on the audience tape of the Birmingham gig, simply because the mic became unplugged shortly before Ian started singing. You can hear him singing, very quietly, as it is only being picked up by one of the mics in the amps, but you can hardly make out a word he is saying. I've spent ages trying to isolate the vocals in this part of the audience tape, but I don't think I will ever get anywhere with it.

The soundcheck version is virtually inaudible, lyrically.
stepoutside

No Love Lost
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Posts: 143
Reply with quote  #21 

Ok, my bad, i misunderstood what it said on this site under concert info.  Thanks for clearing that up.

TJ

Ceremony
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Posts: 1,162
Reply with quote  #22 

There's been some debate as to why Ceremony cuts in on Still. The reason given to me by Tony Wilson a few years back was that they wanted Still to appear the same way as the bootleg double albums of the time, with tracks wrongly listed (hence the omission of 24 Hours on the vinyl credits, which was subsequently to bite us on the bum), tracks cut (the cut Ceremony is obviously aping Passover from Amsterdam), an incongruous mix of studio stuff and live stuff (Sister Ray on side 2). Still was Factory's "bootleg". They could have called it Moonshine I suppose, but settled for the bootleg distiller instead.......and with "Still" being the antithesis of New Order's "Movement" it all fitted together nicely. All very clever and totally Tony Wilson, though whether he invented this as a reason for Ceremony being cut to cover up the fact that they'd forgotten to start the soundboard recording at the right time, we'll never know now.

The problem with the audibility of the vocals at Birmingham during the first part of Ceremony seems to have been that the mic lead fell out of the back of the mic, or at least didn't have a solid connection, and it took a roadie intervention midway through the song before anyone could hear the amplified vocals. Ian was of course singing passionately, but the only way we have of telling this is the slapback from through the miked guitar amp, which picks up general vocal sounds rather than the actual words. 

Where it said "complete audience recording" on the concert page of the site, it meant that Ceremony is complete on the audience tape, but still sadly without properly audible vocals for the first half.

TJ

Ceremony
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Posts: 1,162
Reply with quote  #23 
You can just about hear certain bits from the Birmingham audience tape, but the precise wording is far from clear. I can make out:

"This is ...... (sounds like nerve)
(can't hear any of second line above the guitar)
This is why the ......
Turn again .......
Listen to the saints .....
(can't get the rest as Bernard steps up the guitar there)
TJ

Ceremony
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Posts: 1,162
Reply with quote  #24 

Breaking news......I have two audience recordings of this show, the one I have been using to try and determine the words to Ceremony, and the other one, which is of inferior sound quality. Just tried the other one and the words are so much clearer, the taper must have been stood in a different position. I can't believe this, all these years and the answers were there all along!  I'll put them up as soon as I have applied some EQ to the tape and isolated the vocal as best I can. Bear with me.

TJ

Ceremony
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Posts: 1,162
Reply with quote  #25 
Right, it sounds very much like:

"This is why .... unnerve me (it doesn't sound like events, almost "buried" instead)
When they tell the same old story (100% definite now)
Someone told me ...... with me/give me
Turn again and turn towards this day (100% certain)
Listen to the saints, they're calling (100% certain)
Find a way and we will be there (75% certain)
(no further vocals until the chorus part)

Oh I'll break them all, no mercy shown
Heaven knows I've got to get somewhere
Watching her, a sinking ship
The times she cried I failed to wake this time

I'll break them down, no mercy shown
Heaven knows it's got to be this way
Avenues all lined with trees
Picture me in ten years time watching
Watching forever
Forever, all this forever

Forever, watching you go
Forever, where you go


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