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imkc1

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Reply with quote  #101 
That's a really great article. Thanks so much all around for all the time well-spent !:-)
350125

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Reply with quote  #102 
Lee: Ya silly sawsage! You pointed me in the direction of another JDC member who I won't name in case he doesn't want me to, and he in turn hooked me up with Stephen Morris, who came up with all kinds of hidden treasure like the previously unknown Good Mood gig. Like I said, the article wouldn't have been complete without input from the likes of yersen. Respect, Chief.
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350125

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Reply with quote  #103 
Cheers for the nice words, Elisium ...a book is a cool idea, in fact my missus has been banging on at me to do it (most curious, given the ear-bashings I got when traipsing around demolition sites in Leeds researching this thing when I should have been spending time with her) but as I think I've already said, it would have to be a collaboration between several of us here, maybe asking a bit too much.

An idea that did cross my mind was to write a book about both JD and New Order in Yorkshire; I was at pretty much all of NO's gigs up here so it would be a sight easier to get down on paper. The drawback is, it would be a pretty slim volume: think NO only played 14 shows in Yorkshire over a six-year period, rather feeble compared to the 13 confirmed Joy Division gigs between 1978-79. But, food for thought...

Oh, and just to illustrate that I'm not an aloof untouchable know-it-all type, here's a related aside: check out the entry for Warsaw's alleged 1977 gig at The Primrose in Buslingthorpe Vale, where I remarked the adjoining byway, Buslingthorpe Lane, has long been considered "one of the most dangerous streets in Leeds...though I've used that route many times and not seen any bother." Hubris comes, and all that...for shortly after the original article was published last April I got fucking pickpocketed on the very same road, in broad daylight and I had my little boy with me too. Didn't realize until I got home. The light-fingered bastard. Goodbye £40, and goodbye Buslingthorpe Lane; from that day to this I've used an alternative route to dear old Chapeltown.

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imkc1

Insight
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Reply with quote  #104 
I think all this info would make a great walking guide, a nice day trip tie-in to the JD Manchester walking guide.
lee

In a Lonely Place
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Reply with quote  #105 
350125 - just seen your message from 26th Oct - I remember now - and apologies for having a memory similar to Barney's LOL! Pleasure to have been of service - and once again - may I say - a great article.
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Elisium

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Reply with quote  #106 
350125

Actually, I think that taking into consideration what you have unearthed already (and predicting what you will undoubtedly discover in the future on this subject as you certainly have a flair for this): that woven into the Joy Division timeline covering this period, added to any known photographs of the band performing from the concerts in Yorkshire, known anecdotal evidence of fans, promotors etc, and crucially if you were further able to garner the memory of a certain Joy Division drummer....then I think you already have a book.....and I for one would definatly be buying a copy.
Musars

The Kill
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Reply with quote  #107 
Record Collector Christmas Edition on page 32 has a flyer for the gig at The Royal Standard Bradford gig on Sunday September 10th.
Not checked it but says supplied by Tracks Auction price £100 to £400.

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JRM
Musars

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Reply with quote  #108 
The flyer sold for £300 says the auction site.
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350125

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Reply with quote  #109 
Yes, I wouldn't have minded that item myself...would have looked mighty fine framed and glazed on our living room wall. Only problem was the wife, who threatened to nail my penis to the bread-board if I dared to plunder our bank account for such a ludicrous sheet of frivolity. Has anyone else here been threatened with violence - or indeed, actually received it - by their spouse for financially indulging their preoccupation with JD?
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dmxi

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Reply with quote  #110 
my favorite threats are "love won't tear you apart but i will!" which is as contradictory as it is 'cute' or
"you'ld wish you were hangin' like your curtis(???) if you dare 'contemplating' (whatever JD item i'm currently bidding on) to dish out our dosh for 'tosh' !"(meaning the umpteenth version of UP,closer,still or boot.)....i fell you,brother.

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Hard_Times

Inside the line
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Reply with quote  #111 
Hi, just read the new updates and there are a few mistakes 350125. you sais the Oldham tower gig was undocumented it isn't, Peter hook mentions it in his book. he also says there was one person in the audience at Halifax and huddesfield and you say no so which is correct? shouldnt we rely on Peter hook as his book is very accurate. Its like the fire escape thing that Peter hook says was Huddersfield and you said it was at halifax.also i cant believe they did a gig in the Hobby horse cos i used to go there alot when I lived at  Lovell park and i never saw any groups there.
350125

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Reply with quote  #112 
Hrumph. Don't wish to be rude old chap, but I recommend you go over the piece again. I didn't refer to Oldham Tower as 'undocumented', just 'obscure', which it most assuredly is - the show isn't even listed in the highly comprehensive Concert Guide here, for example. To my knowledge that gig has only been referred to four times in any kind of media, once by Hooky in a 2005 Guardian interview, again by him in 'Unknown Pleasures', and twice by Stephen Morris - on Rock Family Trees back in 1996, and right here in my article (though it may very well have been discussed in the Forums too, I don't know). 

The 'one person' fable is getting rather tedious now; again, please re-read. Stephen Morris told me this definitely took place in Oldham, not Huddersfield or Halifax - he does say there weren't too many at the first Good Mood gig but certainly more than one - and JD came back for an encore at The Coach House, a hardly likely scenario if they'd just spent the evening playing to a single person. In addition we have the recollections of several audience members, one of which tallies exactly with Mr Morris' account. So let's close the story on that one, eh?

I purposely didn't use Hooky's book as a reference point because - cracking read though it certainly is - there are several inconsistencies which made me question its validity in relation to the article, a good example being the legendary fire escape incident you refer to. Peter Hook writes this was in Huddersfield, Stephen Morris says Halifax - and whilst doing research I visited the Good Mood on several occasions and that fire escape is actually still there, trust me. Besides which, The Coach House was a single-storey venue and as such wouldn't require a whacking great iron staircase down which to escape, whereas The Good Mood was located on the second floor of its parent building. Yes, all ludicrously small points but you see what I'm getting at. For want of a horseshoe, and all that crap. And I don't claim to be infallible either - when I was researching The Revolution in York I took a photograph of entirely the wrong venue, which duly ended up in the original article and made me look a bit of a dildo - even more so as I used to go to the bleeding place when I was a student.

As for The Hobby Horse, you are quite correct Sir. I've had a jar or two in there myself and never seen a live act, and nobody local I spoke to had either bar the one individual quoted in the piece. I did state quite clearly my reservations about the authenticity of that particular chap's deposition, and also remarked it was up to you blokes to decide what should be taken at face value or dismissed out of hand. I can usually tell when I'm being lied to, and his thumbnail portrait of Ian's personality was a little too cheddary for my taste plus he claimed JD played 'Transmission', which wasn't even written then. If a rather more credible witness steps up to contradict me, great, if not, that particular chapter stays right where it is.


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PatTeasdale

A Means To An End
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Reply with quote  #113 
Musars - There have been too many Bradford Royal Standard flyers "surface" in recent years for them all to be truly legit  .... typically from a seller on ebay called "LeedsOddjob" ...all claiming to be legit of course.

IMO they are simply A4 photocopies ... made to look "aged" in some cases ....

I certainly wouldnt part with £3 for one, let alone £300
Toby

Digital
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Reply with quote  #114 

Hard Times.

Peter Hook's book consists of the gig listing from JD Central and transcribed interviews which Hooky then edited. It is very enjoyable and paints a great picture of what it was like to be in the band but it is not a reference book about Joy Division.
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